Curse

Konkadonk · May 01, 2008, 10:09 AM // 10:09

As the title states, I'm out to discover whether this class is true to it's name (Paragon meaning model of excellence). Recently hit 20 with my paragon (died twice on the way there, damn you, survivior title!) and am soon starting to GVG and do HA and I hear that's where paragons excel. Question I have to ask is how do they outperform other classes?

What skills would I be using in a typical GvG/HA scenario? What would my role be? I'm really into the idea of buffing my team's defense, but I also know that not taking spear attacks to apply some pressure is a bad idea.

I also do RA/TA quite a bit on my ranger (50 points so far!) and noticed that opposing Paragons seem quite lacking in their abilities. What kind of build isuseful in these arenas?

Thank you in advance for any help. I would much appreciate it!

Alex the Great · May 01, 2008, 10:15 AM // 10:15

you pretty much go how you said, some defensive shouts, and a couple spear attacks. Many paragons also bring mesmer interupts like [cry of frustration]

Stormlord Alex · May 01, 2008, 10:25 AM // 10:25

The paragon is more similar to a model of idiocy.
What 'tard at ANet thought it'd be a good idea to create a class with: infinite energy; ranged warrior-strength dps; warrior-strength AL; a permanent, unstrippable IAS; and massively powerful, unstrippable, stackable passive damage/healing/defense buffs; ... I dunno, but that guy needs a slap.

anyho, as a para you do a lot - couple of spear attacks, [[aggressive refrain], and an anthem to keep it up - then an shout to fuel energy, and whatever the hell the team then needs you to do with your infinite energy (mes interrupts, [[mirror of disenchantment], and [[defensive anthem] are common)

pipo · May 01, 2008, 10:28 AM // 10:28

i really like to play paragon in pvp because u can stay allive long with a nice build
i tend to use this build in PvP :
[build prof=Paragon/Ranger][Poison Tip Signet][Barbed Spear][Spear of Lightning][Mighty Throw][Leader's Comfort][Melandru's Resilience][Troll Unguent][Resurrection Signet][/build]

netniwk · May 01, 2008, 10:35 AM // 10:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by pipo

i really like to play paragon in pvp because u can stay allive long with a nice build
i tend to use this build in PvP :
[build prof=Paragon/Ranger][Poison Tip Signet][Barbed Spear][Spear of Lightning][Mighty Throw][Leader's Comfort][Melandru's Resilience][Troll Unguent][Resurrection Signet][/build]

Let me guess,you also like playing a wammo because you can stay alive long.....

Bobby2 · May 01, 2008, 10:44 AM // 10:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stormlord Alex

The paragon is more similar to a model of idiocy.
What 'tard at ANet thought it'd be a good idea to create a class with: infinite energy both WY! and GftE! got nerfed. don't make it seem like a second Soul Reaping; ranged warrior-strength dps true; warrior-strength AL; a permanent, unstrippable IAS it's either one or the other Alex. if you're making a point of durability, Cracked Armour cannot be ignored; and massively powerful, unstrippable, stackable passive damage/healing/defense buffs lol there's no SY! in PvP, so I'd like to see some 'massively powerful' examples as nothing comes to mind; ... I dunno, but that guy needs a slap. true

/12chars

Moloch Vein · May 01, 2008, 10:51 AM // 10:51

Actually, Leadership is far more broken as an energy management attribute in PvP than Soul Reaping, as it stands.

OSUJay · May 01, 2008, 10:55 AM // 10:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby2

/12chars

Cracked armor can be removed rather easily so his point about the massive armor + permanent, unstrippable IAS holds. Hell you could go Necro secondary and pass the cracked armor along to someone else if you felt like it.

ZenRgy · May 01, 2008, 10:59 AM // 10:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby2

lol there's no SY! in PvP, so I'd like to see some 'massively powerful' examples as nothing comes to mind;

[Defensive Anthem]
[Song of Restoration]
[Ballad of Restoration]
[Aria of Restoration]

Just to name a few.

michaelhunter81 · May 01, 2008, 11:36 AM // 11:36

oy and i thought paragons where lame ass hell, looks like they need a nerf tree rather then a stick comparded to the other classes

exilesfury · May 01, 2008, 02:29 PM // 14:29

Well the only thing about having paragons is that you have to
1) Have a good build.
2) Be able to use it well.
A lot of people in RA don't fit either category, and I always hate ending up with someone who does something as stupid as running around with no armor...

Minime The Shadow · May 01, 2008, 02:50 PM // 14:50

btw to point out about those examples stated above as massively powerful examples, really are not.

How, for an elite, is a sub-100 heal every 20 seconds, "massively powerful" same with ballard of restoration.

also its hard to state they have infinite energy, something like anthem of flame boosts energy, but only if the party hasnt split, in ra or ta with just 4 party members it still loses u energy, and if as stated u take mesmer interupt that costs 15 energy, u will run low.

they do have tonnes of potential, but its not as easy as it sounds, hence many people trying and failing the builds, once accustomed to the roles in various pvp arenas, you should find them very useful. And fun to play.

hope that last bit helps

Alex the Great · May 01, 2008, 07:15 PM // 19:15

the problem that everyone mentions that makes them op-ed is the armour, but permenant cracked armour kinda screws that over. ya i know there are monks, but If you are doing a lot of shouting your just gonna e-denial your own monk lol.

toastgodsupreme · May 01, 2008, 10:06 PM // 22:06

It's so weird to see everyone talking about Para DPS.

Like it's something to be afraid of (or proud of if you're the para). Single target only... ok, maybe good in pvp, right? Not even. If a war comes charging at me, I get a little nervous. If a para locks onto me, I giggle and let them do whatever they want. Oh noes! +17 damage from their attack skill! HEALZ PLX!

I have a para, it's boring to play. You're VERY limited in what you can do. Want to come as DPS? Sorry, we got warriors and rangers doing that better than you. And they can do damage to multiple foes.

So what's left? Defense mostly. So you're good at defense, well, there's like, 3 builds that you can run and not get laughed at by a team. And really, that got boring fast.

Antithesis · May 01, 2008, 10:15 PM // 22:15

Realistically, without SY and TNTF, how many of us would be playing Paragon in PvE? They were the redheaded stepchild before the Imbagon template arrived on the scene and it was near impossible to get into a PuG.

These two skills have opened the class to thousands of players who otherwise would have completely overlooked the Paragon. As relatively experienced players, we know that neither SY nor TNTF are required to make a strong Para, but we got our start precisely because we were attracted by the skills we're now crying are OP'd.

A similar reasoning can be applied to Ursan, it's opened up high-level PvE to the masses and that's what matters to Anet, not satisfying the needs of the 5% of self-proclaimed 'elite' players. They need a customer base for GW2 and Ursan keeps scrubs playing. Nerf Ursan and watch the playerbase nosedive. That may mean nothing to you or I, but it matters to the beancounters.

Racthoh · May 01, 2008, 10:16 PM // 22:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by toastgodsupreme

Sorry, we got warriors and rangers doing that better than you. And they can do damage to multiple foes.

AoE wins in Urgoz and The Deep, pretty much everywhere else single target damage is far superior.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antithesis

Realistically, without SY and TNTF, how many of us would be playing Paragon in PvE?

I was quite fond of my Cruel Spear which at the time was stronger than Eviscerate.

MisterT69 · May 01, 2008, 10:42 PM // 22:42

A lot of people are complaining about the para's IAS and DPS. Well considering that with AR, they have cracked armor, taking them down to squishy level, and SY+TNTF is pretty much all PVE there. The problem is the PVP aspect. The fact that these paras are pumping out near monk-like healing with unstrippable chants and shouts is causing all the problems. Well so what, monks these days seem to think they're too good for pvp, so let the paragons do what they do best /endsarcasm

Antithesis · May 01, 2008, 10:50 PM // 22:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Racthoh

I was quite fond of my Cruel Spear which at the time was stronger than Eviscerate.

But you're the exception to the rule Rac, we all know that

I didn't give the Para a fair go until Godmode gave me a reason to try it.

Konkadonk · May 01, 2008, 11:46 PM // 23:46

I'm thankful for the help I received in initial posts, but can someone end this stupid flame war and get back on topic? I still don't know my true use in a TA situation, or in GvG really. Do I stand with my team in GvG, buffing with Def Anthem/SoR and do I just churn out spear attacks in RA.

P.S. Stop using other's threads to continue your little wars, that's not what the boards are here for.

Jean Ridders · May 02, 2008, 12:13 AM // 00:13

Wow.... Wasn't aware there was so much hate towards paras, PvE or otherwise.

At any rate... There's been enough crap on here to completely derail the topic, I'll just cut to the helping bit.

I usually just PvE as para and the few times I did GvG I ran SoR. Def Anthem is also good since most of the casters when the heat is on. So yeah. if you're running PvP para, in my very limited experience mind you, you stand mostly in buffs and a few spear attacks.

I usually carry only one or two spear taps in any situation as is. Paras are most useful in their party-wide buffs IMO. There's probably a lot of people that would argue that with me, but after reading all this crazy bitching, I think I'll just leave the topic with that last two cents on the counter.